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	<title>Comments on: What&#8217;s Actually Happening In Iraq?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://submitresponse.co.uk/weblog/2003/03/27/whats-actually-happening-in-iraq/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://submitresponse.co.uk/weblog/2003/03/27/whats-actually-happening-in-iraq/</link>
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		<title>By: Jack</title>
		<link>http://submitresponse.co.uk/weblog/2003/03/27/whats-actually-happening-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-424</link>
		<dc:creator>Jack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2003 16:49:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mottram.textdriven.com/weblog/?p=338#comment-424</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I think it is meant as a long term solution - or at least a medium term one: these multiple &#039;truths&#039; will be quite sticky, especially on the internet where all the alternative &#039;facts&#039; will linger in newspaper archives forever. Not that the truth won&#039;t come out eventually, but the obfuscatory cloud of alternative near-truths will hang around for a long time...&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;Interesting distinction in that Chomsky piece between Preventive and Pre-emptive War... for some lighter reading, there&#039;s a nice profile of the Chomsk from the New Yorker excerpted &lt;a&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it is meant as a long term solution - or at least a medium term one: these multiple &#8216;truths&#8217; will be quite sticky, especially on the internet where all the alternative &#8216;facts&#8217; will linger in newspaper archives forever. Not that the truth won&#8217;t come out eventually, but the obfuscatory cloud of alternative near-truths will hang around for a long time&#8230;</p>
<p>Interesting distinction in that Chomsky piece between Preventive and Pre-emptive War&#8230; for some lighter reading, there&#8217;s a nice profile of the Chomsk from the New Yorker excerpted <a>here</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Leon</title>
		<link>http://submitresponse.co.uk/weblog/2003/03/27/whats-actually-happening-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-423</link>
		<dc:creator>Leon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2003 14:50:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mottram.textdriven.com/weblog/?p=338#comment-423</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Oh, I know what Clarke said is sensible. I&#039;m just having a cheap dig. Having said that, you&#039;d expect them to have thought through possible scenarios, and have plans to deal with them; in the propaganda war, &quot;adapt and adjust as appropriate&quot; is a hell of a lot less certain than &quot;shock and awe,&quot; and it&#039;s maybe indicative that, behind the fug of bullshit and nonsense trotted out by the Pentagon, there&#039;s a lot less certainty about the means and methods of &quot;liberating&quot; Iraq than there was a week ago.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;As for the &quot;facts,&quot;it is good spin, but it&#039;s not a long term solution for them, and could easily backfire, particularly if there is a lot of media focus on the problems of accuracy in counting the bodies.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, I know what Clarke said is sensible. I&#8217;m just having a cheap dig. Having said that, you&#8217;d expect them to have thought through possible scenarios, and have plans to deal with them; in the propaganda war, &#8220;adapt and adjust as appropriate&#8221; is a hell of a lot less certain than &#8220;shock and awe,&#8221; and it&#8217;s maybe indicative that, behind the fug of bullshit and nonsense trotted out by the Pentagon, there&#8217;s a lot less certainty about the means and methods of &#8220;liberating&#8221; Iraq than there was a week ago.</p>
<p>As for the &#8220;facts,&#8221;it is good spin, but it&#8217;s not a long term solution for them, and could easily backfire, particularly if there is a lot of media focus on the problems of accuracy in counting the bodies.</p>
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		<title>By: nicky</title>
		<link>http://submitresponse.co.uk/weblog/2003/03/27/whats-actually-happening-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-422</link>
		<dc:creator>nicky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2003 14:46:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mottram.textdriven.com/weblog/?p=338#comment-422</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?SectionID=40&amp;ItemID=3293&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;z net&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?SectionID=40&amp;ItemID=3293">z net</a></p>
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		<title>By: nicky</title>
		<link>http://submitresponse.co.uk/weblog/2003/03/27/whats-actually-happening-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-421</link>
		<dc:creator>nicky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2003 14:42:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mottram.textdriven.com/weblog/?p=338#comment-421</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;There&#039;s a really interesting piece by Chomsky here at ZNet -- &lt;a href=&quot;http://zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?SectionID=40&amp;ItemID=3293&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s a really interesting piece by Chomsky here at ZNet &#8212; <a href="http://zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?SectionID=40&amp;ItemID=3293"></a></p>
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		<title>By: Jack</title>
		<link>http://submitresponse.co.uk/weblog/2003/03/27/whats-actually-happening-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-420</link>
		<dc:creator>Jack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2003 14:12:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mottram.textdriven.com/weblog/?p=338#comment-420</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Dunno - I see her name a lot in Google news feeds, and have never bothered to find out. Maybe Australia is full of Mottrams.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;As for the to and fro of &#039;facts&#039; - it&#039;s a good spin tactic, where you allow information to dribble out unchecked, revise it, negate it, issue conflicting statements, with the end result that no one can get a handle on what actually happens. Even the number 17 in your post is under constant revision. The Iraqis said it was 14 initially, Robert Fisk, who was on the scene pretty quickly, estimates 20. All these little discrepancies work in the favour of the US, as there is no truth or fact, just a bewildering array of possibilities that are cherry-picked  by commentators depending on their allegiance. That said, most of the World at One today seemed to be meta-reporting of the problem of conflicting reports, rather than any attempt to assess the veracity of those reports.&lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;What Victoria Clarke said strikes me as perfectly sensible - how else do you fight a war but by reacting to the enemy. The US are just taken aback that there &lt;em&gt;is&lt;/em&gt; an &#039;enemy.&#039; They seem genuinely to have believed that Iraq would just roll over and cheer the liberating troops, and now they have to take into account that there are significant numbers of troops loyal to Saddam Hussein, and that the Iraqi public might not be peachy keen on swapping a homegrown dictator for colonial overlords...&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dunno - I see her name a lot in Google news feeds, and have never bothered to find out. Maybe Australia is full of Mottrams.</p>
<p>As for the to and fro of &#8216;facts&#8217; - it&#8217;s a good spin tactic, where you allow information to dribble out unchecked, revise it, negate it, issue conflicting statements, with the end result that no one can get a handle on what actually happens. Even the number 17 in your post is under constant revision. The Iraqis said it was 14 initially, Robert Fisk, who was on the scene pretty quickly, estimates 20. All these little discrepancies work in the favour of the US, as there is no truth or fact, just a bewildering array of possibilities that are cherry-picked  by commentators depending on their allegiance. That said, most of the World at One today seemed to be meta-reporting of the problem of conflicting reports, rather than any attempt to assess the veracity of those reports.</p>
<p>What Victoria Clarke said strikes me as perfectly sensible - how else do you fight a war but by reacting to the enemy. The US are just taken aback that there <em>is</em> an &#8216;enemy.&#8217; They seem genuinely to have believed that Iraq would just roll over and cheer the liberating troops, and now they have to take into account that there are significant numbers of troops loyal to Saddam Hussein, and that the Iraqi public might not be peachy keen on swapping a homegrown dictator for colonial overlords&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Leon</title>
		<link>http://submitresponse.co.uk/weblog/2003/03/27/whats-actually-happening-in-iraq/comment-page-1/#comment-419</link>
		<dc:creator>Leon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Mar 2003 12:39:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mottram.textdriven.com/weblog/?p=338#comment-419</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;By the way, ABC Australia&#039;s breakfast anchor is one Linda Mottram. A relation?&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By the way, ABC Australia&#8217;s breakfast anchor is one Linda Mottram. A relation?</p>
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